095 - The Sketch is Moving!

Kurt: 0:20

Hey, Jamie, what's

Jamie 1: 0:21

cracking. Good morning. Good morning,

Kurt: 0:29

Mr.

Jamie 1: 0:30

Formal over here. Yeah. Well, I mean, it's, trying to, to balance your enthusiasm it's it is. Yeah. Cheers coffee.

Kurt: 0:41

Brand brand placement

Jamie 1: 0:42

and placement.

Kurt: 0:45

Is it, does it consider brand placement? Would we pay dues to the

Jamie 1: 0:48

AI? I don't think it works that way.

Kurt: 0:54

I got the sweet mug, I'll start off by saying I've got this sweet tumbler mug. because I'm on the small firm exchange. So shout out to the small firm exchange. So they sent us this around the holiday because, COVID times we can't do a face-to-face committee meetings. And so each of them, instead of a face-to-face committee meeting, each one of us got a mug with some, have you ever tried the, the instant Starbucks

Jamie 1: 1:26

coffee? Yeah.

Kurt: 1:28

No, there was one of those. So it was, it was filled with some goodies.

Jamie 1: 1:33

They knew it was you. And they, they were like, how do we do a coffee for Curt? And they're like, let's, let's see if we can get some product placement on that podcast is,

Kurt: 1:44

and then, yeah. now we're talking about the, so a little bit of comradery, right. I think it's, I think it goes a long way. When you think about, volunteering on these committees and, and, not being able to have the, for those that have never been on the committee or, or not really experienced it, Annual, you get an annual meeting, a face to face, in the before times, and you would be able to, get to see, meet up with either old friends and new friends. And this is how Jamie and I became good friends as we were on the young architects forum together. And we had these face-to-face meetings and then you, you do the formal, the work of the committee, and then you go out to dinner or a tour or something, more social and active afterward or in between. And you build these relationships and friendships. And that's how, if, if anybody wanted to know the origin story, that's it in a nutshell between me and Jamie. So, no,

Jamie 1: 2:41

absolutely. I mean, and, and not just that, but I mean, I think you're right. It's that I think that, gifts like that and, and just even just, little, thoughtful presentations of things, kind of gives you just sort of, an indication that people weren't just, phoning it in, that they're, they're really kind of thinking about who they're, who they're working with and, and, and how they want to connect to them. I think that's, that's pretty neat. I like that.

Kurt: 3:04

Yeah. Do you need to get yourself onto a, another national committee to, to

Jamie 1: 3:11

get my tumbler? no, no, well, no, it's just, I think it's, Jamie's on a little bit of a break from the AIA stuff. but, but, but I am, I am actually on an, a national committee right now, so, oh,

Kurt: 3:24

Which one, is it a secret?

Jamie 1: 3:27

Yes, it's a secret committee. It's a, it's a black op top secret, architecture. No, it's,

Kurt: 3:32

it's the coffee, the coffee committee. No,

Jamie 1: 3:36

it's a preservation technology, code committee. and it's actually a subcommittee of that where we're focused on main street in historic preservation. And so we're kind of looking at, building codes and, cause codes are right now going through, revamped, they get they're on sort of a cycle and they have the update and they have, hearings and testimonies and, edits and suggestions. And one of the groups that is. Sort of, an organization that's, tapped into for suggestions is the apt, the preservation technology group, nationally. and they have that focus and they brought in some people from all over the U S to be on this main street and historic preservation as sort of, subject experts or, influencers or, folks who are doing it day to day from a, from a different perspective, and sort of looking at existing buildings.

Kurt: 4:32

that's cool. Yeah. The, I think in historic preservation of influencer is the building.

Jamie 1: 4:39

Absolutely. and, and it's, and I think it's, it's, it's goes back to that whole story idea, right? Who who's telling its story and how are we interacting with it or discovering, what it is. so yeah, that's always, I think it always the way that you and I have, characterize our perception of, our careers, our education, and now our practice, yeah. All that stuff sort of plays into it, I think.

Kurt: 5:05

Yeah. So, I mean, kinda building HEPA Tik TOK,

Jamie 1: 5:11

should it, it's more, I'm going to say. And I think you were about to say it too. Shouldn't have a tick tock. right. And, and what would be its go-to like karaoke song. So I mean, it's

Kurt: 5:27

well, we'll have to come back to that one. Think about appropriate historic, song. For, for a tick tock for these, these

Jamie 1: 5:36

are the big questions that are, we spend our times offline thinking about the covert

Kurt: 5:41

committee meeting. Yeah, that's right. Yeah.

Jamie 1: 5:44

It takes some, takes a big segue. Like we have like part one part, two part two is definitely that, there's a

Kurt: 5:50

whole pop culture. It's going to result in something even nicer than this tumbler.

Jamie 1: 5:57

Yeah. Your reward. Well, but, but I think it goes back to what you're saying too, is that it's, it's an opportunity to connect with other folks who, are, wanting to, to, meet other people who are interested in the same things professionally, but at the same time, there's a service component to it as well. I mean, you and I both got into young architects forum, I think because we recognized that there was a lot of things that needed to change about our. and that we wanted to be a part of that change and at least help it. So, but at some point that's becomes exhausting. and so, so you back yourself out of those types of service activities, and you focus on other things that are similar, but maybe a little

Kurt: 6:40

different. Yeah. That's a good way to put it. That's my next move is the, the, Irish goodbye. This is one let's say just kind of disappear. Just disappear just

Jamie 1: 6:53

for a little while.

Kurt: 6:57

Anyway. So, how's how's your coffee mug treatment these days, if anything exciting?

Jamie 1: 7:01

I actually, no,

Kurt: 7:05

it's not a via that.

Jamie 1: 7:06

No, it's not a via, and, it's,

Kurt: 7:08

Yeah, nothing, nothing, nothing new to report, nothing of note. I actually, I've got some of the little city that you gave me still. There you go. I've I've, I've, I've exhausted almost the entire bag. And so I had to buy some other, some other and Honduran coffee to, to, to not, what do you call it? focus. I don't want, I didn't want to burn through that bag too quickly. So if I switch back for today to the, the, the violet crown, which again has that, that sort of fruity Berry scent aroma to it and taste, but I'm actually.

Jamie 1: 7:53

Sounds like it. I mean, it's, it's influencing now your buying habits. So that's, that's kind of a big thing, right?

Kurt: 7:58

Yeah. Yeah. Thanks. Thanks to Jamie.

Jamie 1: 8:01

Yeah. Maybe I just need to like, figure out what my coffee funk is and then get something different. I think

Kurt: 8:09

it's time. Yeah. So, exactly. And I think the sketches that we're going to look at today are definitely going to get us out of, out of all the funk. cause we, Jamie has teased some new, new techniques, new delivery methods. I don't know. It's pretty exciting. it's always been exciting though to see your sketches, that pop up every day, something new, something different. A variation on an old theme or something like that. But the new year is upon us and Jamie decided to up the ante and,

Jamie 1: 8:44

with a healthy dose of encouragement from, from my co-conspirator. So, yeah.

Kurt: 8:49

we asked him for like

Jamie 1: 8:50

three years, right? Yeah, exactly. You only been asking for a little while, but yeah, we're definitely trying to bring some of the process, to light literally, in a, in a different way. And then hopefully we'll continue to experiment kind of weave it into the podcast and, and then the video cast as well.

Kurt: 9:11

So yes. So, w well, before, before we get into the, the two sketches that we're going to talk about real quick, but, so what Jamie has done is he's recorded himself. Making the sketches. So it's like the behind the scenes or the, the, well in front of the camera, behind the camera, whichever you want to put it. But, the process, as Jamie said, and then he's also done a little movie magic and, and sort of truncated it down to a two minute. time-lapse. Which, Jamie already sketches very fast at 10 minutes sketches, so it's down a two minute Tyler, which is kind of fun to watch because things move, obviously, they're moving five times faster, I guess. Cause they're about two minutes. Right, right. And so know there's my math skills working today. We're on. But, anyway, without, sort of, giving way too much, but it, it got me thinking, just the amount of technology now we have available to us. So somewhat related, but sort of, a little tangent and that, within our phones and computers and, and software, really the, the ease of use of softwares. I actually, while I'm making, like trying to put this stuff together for the new YouTube channel, I, then find myself watching other YouTube videos. Right. And, and somehow, YouTube knows I'm an architect and, and they're sending me these old videos of Tom Mayne from Morphosis architects in a Ted talk or at a building talking about one of his projects and so on. And, they're like nine, 10 years old, six years old, sometimes six, well, The posts, the YouTube upload is six or 10 years old. I think the videos are some times even older, even older. I know, I know a couple are definitely wailed and he didn't say his Ted talk, which I don't remember when that was, he's showing still image slides of, of some of his projects. And back then at some un-built work. And now, if you're not, I mean, I, I don't want to put the pressure on, but may, if you're not doing video, right. Th the moving image is so captivate. And now the ease of, the accessibility to that for all of us, even in fairly, crude forms, I think, which is why YouTube is kind of blown up and, all the various video formats on Instagram and, and tick-tock and Twitter and wherever. anyways, so that I don't know what to call that segment. That is really just, the, the long form introduction to, to these sketches. I was trying to give Jamie a little bit of a runway, a runway toward, when we push play on the, on these time-lapses, I dunno, it's just, it's just, it's really, it's fascinating to me.

Jamie 1: 12:11

And it's an evolution of technology that is, has run parallel to kind of this information sharing, And some of it, like you're saying, I think we're, we're not even necessarily recognizing that evolution as we're living it. and, and so it's like you were asking me, because we have been bantering back and forth about, what's going to be the best way for me to share some of the process while we're working remote, you're in Flint, I'm in Austin, we're still doing this podcast. We're still doing a video where we both have our independent setups. and what's going to be the best way to sort of integrate all those things. with, there's no one else here holding the camera kind of thing. so I think that, yeah, there's a, it's some of that technology just sort of has become pervasive in our lives and as it evolves and changes, we find ourselves adapting to it. and I think. becoming, and not to draw the parallel completely back to architecture, but it's, it's like I was describing to somebody in our office this week is when I, I only learned one CAD program, in school. and, and even that it was very, very basic course. and it wasn't necessarily tied to architecture. It was sort of, kind of learning how to use this CAD program. It was AutoCAD, but, and in that there was, any other kind of parallel programs that, that used it, we would do a little segment, it was, it was, it was a course. it was a course in the engineering department. It wasn't even in the architecture department.

Kurt: 13:40

but

Jamie 1: 13:41

yeah, but, but then in practice, I have worked on multiple different CAD platforms. myself and, and I'm not necessarily, I wouldn't put myself in that category of being, a proponent of AutoCAD or, or BIM technology or, that kind of, 3d visualization. I mean, that's, I mean, yes, I know how to do all those things and I have done those in and still do those things in professional practice, but it's, it's not, I'm not, devoted to it. and, and, but yet even in that, even though I wouldn't put myself in that category, I probably have worked in a professional setting on four different CAD systems that I can think of off hand. and and so my point was sort of, kind of parallel to yours is as technology and things sort of evolve and change, it's a lot of just tools. at the end of the day, it's just a lot of tools. it doesn't, and you can choose to use them or not. I think what we're trying to do, and, and I think the part that sort of stands out to me is, is when you take a tool or learn a new tool and, find a way to innovate, find a big way to be creative about it, and kind of put your own little stamp into it. So, hopefully we, hopefully we can do that with this, with these, with these sketches and, and how we fold it into the way we talk about them.

Kurt: 15:05

Yeah. the, the, the last, last thing, cause it was a good segue as far as talking about tools. but it tests your, your comment about like how pervasive technology or how quickly it evolves. Remember. Our Manil experiment when we were in Houston, trying to live record, an episode of, I mean, it was actually looking back, it's a lot of fun to have stumbled through. That was,

Jamie 1: 15:29

that was like a living and outtake reel. I mean, but it

Kurt: 15:34

was fun. I mean, we have cables. I don't know why we didn't have wireless things, but, I mean, that's only a few years ago. And then we were like trying not to tip over the camera with the cable, with the pen and your arm.

Jamie 1: 15:48

And then there was a guy over to the side and who knows what he was trying to do.

Kurt: 15:53

Strange, strange guy doing yoga and playing guitar.

Jamie 1: 15:57

I think he was filming himself to, I dunno, it was like,

Kurt: 16:01

let's see. There you go. Technology. Yeah. Yeah. Anyway, so, so let me, let me cue up. Link you up our first, first sketch here. and so you, you posted this as on the second of the year, so

Jamie 1: 16:14

the,

Kurt: 16:15

day after new year's day, right. That's what they would say. So we've got to pause at the moment. So what we're, what our game plan is, and you can edit and correct me is we're going to, we're going to kind of run, run through this, sketch the time-lapse and talk about what's Jamie doing and, and the process behind it. And actually I've got a few questions in that comments on, certain aspects already. Cause, this, you posted this on the second, so we've all seen this a few times. So I guess, how do you wanna, you wanna, this is going to be a new, a new topic for us. So how do we do this play? And

Jamie 1: 16:58

I know, or we, we, I think you push play and sort of tee up your questions in that kind of we'll run it back and forth that way. And we'll see, like I said, this is the

Kurt: 17:08

new one, so we'll see. So the first, the first, the first try of, of going through this, well, I, yeah, so I'll, I'll, I'm going to hit go. I'm getting nervous now. That's it? That's it good. All right. All right. So play. So the first thing I, I, I remind myself is that you're left-handed, I mean, I know this, but I, I forget. And, and my dad was a lefty and so

Jamie 1: 17:33

my dad, my dad was the lefty to cool.

Kurt: 17:39

I always remember, left these have to kind of orient themselves to the paper and in a different fashion than righties. And, and so, this is, this is interesting to watch, the development of your sketch. Does that help? I think the second sketch is going to be a little more important as for orientation because the mixed media, but, anyway, other than that, I really love seeing the speed and, and I think for the educational component to others is that, I'm getting really nervous now is to not fret, right. It's not to belabor a certain things, right. And that you're blocking things out and. You're coming back and finishing and in adapting. Right.

Jamie 1: 18:21

Well, right. And, and I think that's the whole thing is that it's, as you sort of watch me do the sketch is that there's the, the framing of the page is, is I'm trying to get the purposely knowing that this is going to be sort of a, I'm going to fill the form and use that diagonal of the book. It's just sort of, it's a little bit of a trick, that I wanted to employ and, based on the pose and the image that I'm kind of working from. but I also knew that I was going to sort of set up this background that you're seeing right now and sort of it kinda be locked further, elongates the page. and

Kurt: 18:54

we're gonna, it's going to have to go run, run through one more

Jamie 1: 18:57

time. Yeah. And so I think that, that as you sort of see that the form is, it takes shape, but it's also sort of finding its place on the page and. To your question before is, yeah, there's an acknowledgement that, even as you're sort of seeing these areas kind of getting crosshatched in and, shade and shadow to kind of build up the volume of the body, and sort of the turning of one, one aspect or one form, one plane into another plane, those edges don't always have to be a hard line. They can be a hatched area, and then he did a built up patch. You also see that the patches sort of changed direction, when you're only using one pen and only one line weight, you can cross hatch gets, it gets that extra depth of field and extra weight to the form visually. but changing direction does the same thing. so you can almost read it as one part of that arm in that center section is sort of patch one direction and the other is hatched in a different, and that gives you a little bit of an angle into. those two objects almost intersecting, one another and that's, that's really intentional. and then you can also see that, that they, the grip on the pen doesn't necessarily change too, too much, especially when, maybe when I'm filling it in a little bit more, but there isn't a whole lot of gaps between movement. it's, it's all really, really pretty fast and that's, that's intentional. Perfect.

Kurt: 20:26

So then we can go to the next one. Do we need to have like a little segue talk or just go do the next one and then do

Jamie 1: 20:37

no recap. I think, I think, w we'll we'll probably be better on the second one than the

Kurt: 20:42

first one. I think that was good. I mean, to run throughs and that's why I paused at the end of the second one. It's more like a four minute, three and a half. Yeah. And that'll, I think it'll be fine. Do you want to try and do a whole thing in the one

Jamie 1: 20:57

who is trying to do one in the first one? Yeah. This next one. Yeah. Oh my God. This is, this is where you get

Kurt: 21:04

real. I thought it was good though. I mean, I'm not, I'm not trying to complain or anything, but

Jamie 1: 21:13

it

Kurt: 21:13

just, it was, it was sort of like this one's solid two minutes. So, maybe it's a little bit easier. So yeah, a little bit. I'm not less and less stressed out now, but okay, good. You got all

Jamie 1: 21:24

that, there's

Kurt: 21:25

like the heebie-jeebies the, the Jimmy's. So in this second sketch, you're mixing media and starting out with this Conti crayon. And, and based on what we just talked about in the other sketch, it's very interesting to see the progression of this sketch and how you're again, like blocking out the entire composition in a very rough fashion. I mean, cause it's a figure, right? You were looking at a human figure. So there's certain shapes that you're trying to create, but then, then it's, it's been fun to watch these sketches because it, the thing I noticed the most is that you're, it's almost like your brain is it knows where to fill in the line work and it's, it doesn't always appear. logical, right? Because of the speed of the sketch, right. You kind of jumped from corner to corner sometimes.

Jamie 1: 22:27

Well, and I think I am jumping around quite a bit, but it's, the, the thing about the contact crayon and, and I like to use it. it was something that I just, when I started using them, to, to draw form it, you realize that the. and I don't know necessarily know if this is sort of me breaking the rules. We've talked about those things before, but it's the fact is that you can use the side of the best use of it as sort of a side. It also forces me to go even faster. So, and I'm also, I'm less afraid of making mistake with the contact round because it's such a light touch, but even in that light touch, in that broad side of the content is you get some interesting shade and shadow and the beginnings of volume, especially with a form like this. and there's sort of a suggestion of kind of moving it across the form and kind of creating that edge. but at the same time, creating a surface, and there was a suggestion of it. And once that suggestions on the page and you'll start to see it here is suggestion of forum is. Begun by creating a little bit of an edge and a little bit of volume, but then quickly moving to other locations so that you're getting the whole thing. And you sort of see me tapping all the way around knowing that that's going to be the framework I'm sort of setting the page, but then literally coming back in now and starting to set a little bit harder edge and sort of playing with a little bit of line weight, but using the content to do that, then it's dropping that and then switching to the pen, and sort of filling in that form and knowing where I'm going to go back to. And it's, there isn't necessarily a set, oh, I'm going to start at this corner and move my way around. But, there's an ability of building up the form. And I think that's sort of the idea here is that you're sort of building up the form, but also building up the sketch and then in areas where there is a deeper sense of shade and shadow, especially. Something like this, where you're only dealing with one line weight, you can see sort of be attention in certain areas. And then there's some tricky areas, faces, certain features that you want to be a little bit more delicate with, in this particular case or a really fine detail. some of those take a little bit, slower buildup in the, in the line work. but then there's also, an ability to once the attention is paid to one of those areas, you see me kind of moving off back to another, kind of pausing for a moment and moving back off of it. because it's just sort of mentally kind of a little bit exhausting, you're working really fast. You kind of have to back yourself out for a moment and then, and then re-engage on the sketch, but then you see it here is I've actually picked back up the content, to kind of finish off some, some features.

Kurt: 25:04

yeah, and I think the point to make is. And I'll pause it there, but then make the one point about this too. If, if some students are listening or people that, may not sketch very often, I think the, the point to make is to not, not, not think that you have to use an eraser. I mean, what was pen you can't or contact you can't, but just, just keep going. Right. And seeing where it goes. And I think as Jamie explained, the process is sort of emerges. The, the sketch is an emergent, image out of the process.

Jamie 1: 25:44

And these are in, like you said, two, two at the beginning of it is, these are 10 minutes. This is 10 minutes of time that's been sped up. so that, we can discuss it here and they can be shared a little bit more readily, but, but it is, they are, they are relatively quick. There are parts of it that as you're doing it, I'm not sort of dwelling on it here, but, there's difficult parts that I, as I'm drawing it gone. Hmm. That's not quite right. that's, that's not exactly the way I'm thinking it's, it's working. And so in those instances too, sometimes that's where you see me move off of a certain area, kind of focus on some other areas for a little bit and then kind of come back to them. give myself a moment, to, to pause. And, even though it's a quick sketch and kind of move forward.

Kurt: 26:25

Yeah. So, I mean, I pulled up the, the, your, your grid of, of, for the moment since I don't want to keep running the sketches over and over again. and, and so what we'll do is I'll, I mean, I'll reveal some of our own process for the podcast is that we're going to try and, snip out, those two. Quick chats about the each sketch and, posted on our YouTube and be able to share it as sort of a vignette of, the visual as the process, and then the explanation or the, the sort of what's the inside the director's studio or, just to peek behind the curtain, as

Jamie 1: 27:06

we need to like set up the stage with some plants, you need some plants, two ferns

Kurt: 27:11

between two firms. Next time we get on Kurt. I think somebody already got that one,

Jamie 1: 27:17

two firms for us.

Kurt: 27:19

That'd be great. But the, yeah, I, I think that was, that was a lot of fun and,

Jamie 1: 27:24

Yeah. Thanks. Thanks for, thanks for encouraging all this. I, I, I want to say that one more time is that you thank you for forcing me into, recording my work and trying to lean into my inner Bob Ross moment. that was something I never thought I was actually going to do. I have been asked many, many times and, wasn't sure I would ever do that so

Kurt: 27:49

well, you're welcome. And, we've come a long way since that live, live Manil sketch. that we look back on fondly. Thanks.